Home Office W.I.P

[larry_g1s]

Here is a wip of my home office. I figured if I was going to learn lighting & Kray I would try to mimic something that I new how it was suppose to be lit, direction of th sun, etc. As I said this is a wip, so I will be adding to it. But I thought I'd post it, to get some help/advice.

I'm getting a decent amount of lighting in the room, probably not as much as I'd like, but I can play with that.

Areas of improvement:

• 1. the quality & render time. As you'll notice it took around 46 min for a 1280 x 960, but that was on a Quad Core processor. Correct me if I'm wrong, but compared to some of the times I've seen on the boards, that can get a lot lower (I've attached my settings to compare).
  
  2. You'll notice around the windows the AA isn't all that good, even with AA & Quality being set to High.
  
  3. It seems like the areas where the glass in the French doors meet with the frame, are not being shown...strange !?! (view image with comments for clarity)

Comments as always will be much appreciated.

[acidarrow]

Unless there is something really wrong with the scene, the really high rendertime is because of the AA. Having Thickness of 0 turns it into FSAA, and with Grid 4, it did 16 full screen AA passes.

Try

Grid : 3
Absolute : 0.1 Relative : 0.1
Normal : 0.01 Z : 0.05

Upsample : 1 (or 2)

Thickness : 1 (or 2)

It is my opinion that the AA presets are kind of bad and will probably be changed in the future.

[silverlw]

have you turned on limitdr -1; in krays tailer? That will help AA alot in bright areas like your white windows. If you look among presets for tailor you find limitdr1; but setting it to -1 will make it smarter and adaptive depending on lightsituation. About your glaswindows, if you remove the glas completly can you see the remaining woodframework then or is it still holes in the geomtry? It looks like it's singlesided geometry that will render like holes when viewed from it's backside.

I noticed you use luminosity modell=automatic and your windows are maybe luminous? if so you need to divide the luminous surfaces into parts and lower your values for Luminosity treshold since 500 is very high. It's better to get some grain (and grain will be lower if you divide them into parts) and get rid of the rest of grain with Antialiasing. The fastest and best would be to add Krayindirectrays=limitdr100% to your luminous windows and force luminosity modell to indirect, then it would be way faster. The same goes for blurred reflections. Isn't min100/max100 and blurring accuracy=0 enough?

[larry_g1s]

Hey guys, thanks for the replies. I really appreciate it. I really want to learn Kray, and by some of your comments, there seems to be much that can be learned.

I've posted a new image with a drastic render time cut. I was trying some of the suggestions mentioned, but took it to another machine I have (also a Quad Core) and it rendered it much faster. It must have been because the previous machine I rendered on was still being used by me for other applications. I didn't think it would effect render time that much, but apparently so. I can tell the AA is much cleaner. I think there are still some things that I can learn to cut render time more. I will try with the limitdr -1, this was done with the limitdr 1, I didn't notice you mention the "-1" till after I rendered it.

I've also attached a higher res. limited region of the French doors, but with out the glass there. And as you can see the frame renders just fine.

I noticed you use luminosity modell=automatic and your windows are maybe luminous? if so you need to divide the luminous surfaces into parts and lower your values for Luminosity treshold since 500 is very high. It's better to get some grain (and grain will be lower if you divide them into parts) and get rid of the rest of grain with Antialiasing. The fastest and best would be to add Krayindirectrays=limitdr100% to your luminous windows and force luminosity model to indirect, then it would be way faster. The same goes for blurred reflections. Isn't min100/max100 and blurring accuracy=0 enough?

I apologize Silverlw, but about half way through, you lost me...

If by my windows being luminous you mean they have a Luminosity value higher then ?%, then no, they don't have any luminosity in there texture properties.

[silverlw]

[quote="If by my windows being luminous you mean they have a Luminosity value higher then ?%, then no, they don't have any luminosity in there texture properties.[/quote]
OK so you use only lmapping and imageworld/backdrop to light the room or is the sky itself a luminous surface? If it is a polygon/surface it will be rendered as direct if you set luminous treshold to 100% and that takes lot's of time. Force Kray to Indirect mode instead.

[larry_g1s]

"If by my windows being luminous you mean they have a Luminosity value higher then ?%, then no, they don't have any luminosity in there texture properties.

OK so you use only lmapping and imageworld/backdrop to light the room or is the sky itself a luminous surface? If it is a polygon/surface it will be rendered as direct if you set luminous treshold to 100% and that takes lot's of time. Force Kray to Indirect mode instead.

Basically the way I've got it set up right now is much like Jure's tutorial. I've got a Spot Light set up as my main light, Light Intensity 300%, ID^2 1KM with SunSpot modifier applied. I've also got the Skylight texture being used in the Environment panel for sky light GI. Other than that, that's it, nothing is luminous.

I've attached an image of the French doors with the glass put back in. Very strange.

[Pheidian]

Would it be a problem where glass material and the door material are in exactly same point, and Kray somehow reads the border surface to be that glass, not the solid door material?

Are you using the glass materials in different layer than others, and set unseen by radiosity?

I would try to make the scene with luminous ball instead of background lighting, Kray is better in lightning scenes with luminous polygons than backdrop I think?

Other than that, I think your scene looks quite neat...

[larry_g1s]

I've updated a W.I.P of the scene. I've basically re-worked the scene to more accurately portray the dimensions (this is a modification of my home office). It's a wip, because I'm still working on the scene (gotta add the French doors again) and th lighting. Any critic/comments are welcomed.

One question, I've seen some wood floors done on here with a slight gloss to it and a bit blur reflections...what's the best way to do that in Kray?

Would it be a problem where glass material and the door material are in exactly same point, and Kray somehow reads the border surface to be that glass, not the solid door material?

How can this be helped? I mean the glass has to be in the same area.

Are you using the glass materials in different layer than others, and set unseen by radiosity?

I originally had it in the same layer, but then I put it to another layer. Both cases it seems to do it. I'm re-working the scene, so I'll see if it still does it.

I would try to make the scene with luminous ball instead of background lighting, Kray is better in lightning scenes with luminous polygons than backdrop I think?

Other than that, I think your scene looks quite neat...

You seem to prefer using light from lumionus polys...I like your work, so I'll give it a try.

[Janusz Biela]

Better, but still contrast is bad....
1/ You need Skyportals for better FG mapping (You must wait for update)
2/ Try Exponential parametr 1.0
3/ I see You use PATH=0, this is good but with oversample (try 1,4,0.1) 4 pass,
4/ On floor try shader KrayIndirectRays desaturate 50% (this reduce bad colors on wall and ceiling)
5/ floor need better reflection and blurr

[darickster]

think this looks amazing already larry, great stuff

ric

[Pheidian]

no gloss (specularity) used, reflection and reflection blur in advanced tab...

I'll go usually without any incident angles (just basic reflections), around 6-15% reflection, and blurring it 40-70%, try out and see what suits your taste...

[larry_g1s]

Better, but still contrast is bad....
1/ You need Skyportals for better FG mapping (You must wait for update)
2/ Try Exponential parametr 1.0
3/ I see You use PATH=0, this is good but with oversample (try 1,4,0.1) 4 pass,
4/ On floor try shader KrayIndirectRays desaturate 50% (this reduce bad colors on wall and ceiling)
5/ floor need better reflection and blurr

What do you mean by "contrast is bad"? I know what contrast means, I just want to know what you mean by bad in this scene. I'll try some of the other suggestions mentioned, thanks.

think this looks amazing already larry, great stuff

ric

I appreciate it darickster

no gloss (specularity) used, reflection and reflection blur in advanced tab...

I'll go usually without any incident angles (just basic reflections), around 6-15% reflection, and blurring it 40-70%, try out and see what suits your taste...

Seems like people steer away from gloss & specularity in Kray substituting it with reflection, even if it's a tad. Why is that? Did you mean using reflection blurring in the Environment tab, not Advanced tab? Thanks for the comments Pheidian.

[darickster]

Seems like people steer away from gloss & specularity in Kray substituting it with reflection, even if it's a tad. Why is that? Did you mean using reflection blurring in the Environment tab, not Advanced tab? Thanks for the comments Pheidian.

Because in essense glossiness and spec are fake so if you are aiming for realism youhave to disable them, however they still work as a fast substitute on specific materials (like leather) For floors i never use them anymore, it renders out odd and unrealistic.

cheers ric

[larry_g1s]

Alright, here are some recent renders. I still need to try some of the suggestions mentioned to get render time a lot lower.

I've changed up the scene to open it up a bit. I pleased with the initial Kray render but, as you can tell from the two posted, there's quite a bit of post done in PS for the lighting. So I still need to work on that to get it a little more native within Kray. C&C's welcomed. I've also added a cropped section of the larger resolution that I need some help on...what's with the spots/dots?

[Pheidian]

Nice work!

Quick look it seems that weird artifacting is because of the sun light, you can see there should be "sun light" on that places in the couch where there is those speckles... No idea why, caustics off?

Maybe double check the couch material too, bump mapping or something may cause this...

Other than that, looks great, when you get skyportals, these renders will be gold!