small detail splotches

[albertos2008]

hello everibody,
I'm having troubles in some small detail parts like the one I'm posting...

I have tried a lot of different configurations with FG tab... but nothings happen..
I think that the problem is that the scene is lit just by lumipolys (far away)

does anyone has some advice?

thanks!

Alberto

[Janusz Biela]

I suspect this what we see is interior from outside. This problem is common and comes from disorder Photon Map.This os of course normal situation and to prevent this You can use:
- Skyportals (very good idea but difficult)
- delete frame which disorder photons (not useful)
- reduce power of lumi and add Area Light inside room
- use QMC instead FG
- use better FG setup (better solution)
- share only this part of scene scene - then I will check it (the best solution)

[albertos2008]

thanks janusz...
about tweaking FG I've tried a lot of solutions (limit to my knowledge)
I think I will try area lighting....

If you want to have a look I also put my scene here (without textures too heavy)
... but only if you have time!!

thanks!

Alberto

[Janusz Biela]

I check your Kray setup and I suggest:
- do not use recurse 100! it is not necessary to bounce photons more then 10 times (In real word transport of photons is very complicate and also very close ray tracing...only our eyes and brain compensate perfectly problems with dark and bright parts of what we see) We try simulate human eyes by tone mapping - but it is far away from eyes "tone map" perfection.
- the N parameter too small (50 is really small and minimum should be 400)
- FSAA you do not need Grid 4. Grid 3 looks almost the same and time render is shorter. Kray 3.0 will have new AA system then we will forget about problems with slow AA and imperfections.
- I do not think so is necessary goes that much down with Spatial tolerance (from my test 0.07 is enough)
- Path Passes distance is also to big (long render) maximum from my test 75% - under this: light leaks, over 75%: longer render and no differences.
- You do not need 3 passes to find all samples. Enough is 2 passes and this is minimum and maximum value
- Gi resolution: Interiors max 400 mm, exteriors depends from distance 700 mm-2000 mm.
- I suggest not use LWF

I will try post this scene today - then you will see setup.

btw
how about this PerspectiveControlCamera? Is it only 32 bit plugin?

[albertos2008]

thanks janusz... I think that my knowledge on kray is very low!..
sometimes I reach nice quality and I don't know how..

I will try to follow your advice..

perspective control is an old plugin, but very useful because you can easily shift lens on Y and X..
it runs just on 32bit , like many other useful plugs (the most useful from pictrix) so I always work on lightwave 32...

ciao

Alberto

[Janusz Biela]

Here tests:

RAW render:

Scene for testing (update):

testscene.rar

(430.44 KiB) Downloaded 223 times

Override:

[albertos2008]

Thanks Janusz a very big thanks...

[Janusz Biela]

last post with HiRes Override mode:

__________________
Good luck!

[Janusz Biela]

Thanks Janusz a very big thanks...

No problem.
btw
You need some windows in scene to simulate reflection (I added one window on the left) I think also will be good make one more thin long window behind camera on the right.
Without these windows reflected surfaces will look a bit "flat" (no reflection).

[albertos2008]

this was my ogiginal image and I think here there's not big problems..
.. with textures things change alot..

the big problems are coming with close-up view... but with your setup things are going better..

[Janusz Biela]

It is ok, just some GI splotches (wrong set up).
I see your time and it is very bad time (!)
You can not render high quality under 10 min with that resolution.
I suggest as always not to fallow time render instead quality (40 min longer render then this will not ruin You - the time when people put renders and goes to sleep: simply went many years ago). I suggest always try to catch perfections in renders...even if detail are not important or very small
I think for this resolution and scene render time should be 40-60 min (12 HT).

In my scene you can notice: instead of lumi I put Physky. Of course it is does`t matter. More important is Power - if it is too high Power from them (for example Lumi panel over 300% luminescence) then you will get more problems with GI and blur reflection, same with Physky. Why I keep all sources of light "soft".
I prefer Physky because I get more natural light and I can turn ON Sun effect.
Also Area Lights are physical lights so no errors from them in Photon Map.

[albertos2008]

hi Janusz.. about rendertime I'm not pretty sure if is real.. that's because I rendered this image a lot of time using render region then I've added pieces with photoshop... so it could be referred to a small piece..

about physical sky sometimes I use and sometime not (like this case)
I do not use it to better control from where light arrive.. using sky I have to add extra walls and (I think) extra bounce and extra time..

I always try to avoid area lights because sometimes I see noise..

In general I love kray 'cause I love lightwave, I'm 40 year age and I was an amiga user (lightwave 4.0!!)..
but at the same time I'm a designer so I prefer to do not spend a lot of time tweaking parameters, and I have some fixed setups that almost works fine for my needs.. but using uncached softwares like maxwell rendering time is absolutely too long for professional deliveries.. so I always prefer to use kray.

always thanks for your precious help

ciao

Alberto

[Janusz Biela]

I suggest stick with Physky non stop. It is Physical simulation light and using another sources of light (Lumi objects, HDRi) I wasting time. Also Physky has no set up - only position of Sun (I Use non stop the same settings) ...so in the end save time: Load and fire

Area Light has noise because this is problem with tone mapping. The power of photons is very strong near them. K3 has special engine for that - so faster and without noise.


I admire Maxwell render only for Multilight and accuracy (Path Tracing) nothing else.
K3 will have multilight also (this is not difficult to code). I suggest always people who has a lot money and time to use Maxwell (hardware with minimum 80-100 Threats) This configuration will make sense to work comfortable with still images.

First fire I did on Amiga 500 and LW 4.0....and I think skill of user is strongly determined more by knowing software then possibilities.