Would be good to have some early screenshots of what's being developed. Besides making a good program there's good marketting and hype.
WIthout them a good program is not going to gain users or interest. There's so many new renderers coming out and competition is so fierce.
Iray, octane, final render gpu, cycles, and a bunch of unbiased renderers are coming out. Kray needs to do more marketting or software connection like what modo did with cad softwares.
kray 3.0 preview
Re: kray 3.0 preview
I wish I could. But there's not much to show yet except some pretty basic raytracing tests. I also know how important marketing is but it's not up to me to decide... I wish G. would read this forums more often...jnom wrote:Would be good to have some early screenshots of what's being developed. Besides making a good program there's good marketting and hype.
WIthout them a good program is not going to gain users or interest. There's so many new renderers coming out and competition is so fierce.
Iray, octane, final render gpu, cycles, and a bunch of unbiased renderers are coming out. Kray needs to do more marketting or software connection like what modo did with cad softwares.
- Jure
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Keraressi Abdelkarim
- Posts: 719
- Joined: Sun Jan 24, 2010 4:44 pm
Re: kray 3.0 preview
i think kray most be famous better then vray . to do dat kray 3.0 most be stand alone application like maxwell ex... . so when this last one be done . so all people around the world they will know about it . cz i talk with other architects in USA they used max and vray when theyu saw kray quality render they ask me what program i said kray mindberries engine (plugin) and 3D software its lightwave from newtek they told me never hear about it . cz lightwave its not really famous . so why kray better 30 times then lw rneder quality and speed still inside lightwave plz . keep my Kray 3.0 safe xD 
put him alone stand alone plzzzz. (no put it) . its humain for me o_O 
put him alone stand alone plzzzz. (no put it) . its humain for me o_O 
Re: kray 3.0 preview
I love Kray, to me the reflection blur is really fast, I love its GI and more than everything the tone mapping.
But if you say it's better than Vray, maybe you haven't used VRay enough.
For Heavy scenes, Vray turns to be way faster, handles poly better.
Lights act more like real lights. Cameras have real parameters as well as the environment.
INstances are well handled, also for stuff like grass.
Renders are better handled, with Bucket rendering you calculate an image in few minutes.
AA is waaaaayy faster than Kray.
You find tons of ressources, tuts and the manual is really complete.
There a all the passes you need (+ working Alpha channel...)
Tons of shaders, real displacement, microdisplacement, and I could go again and again.
I can't see what you base your judgment on.
I'm not a VRay fan, I had so many projects that just couldn't be handled with LightWave + Kray.
These are the stuff I love, it's a real pleasure to work with this combo but Kray isn't mature yet. You CAN'T use it for serious productions. It's a sad truth. We need working Alpha, faster AA, faster shaders (specific for Kray), displacement, VPR and way more passes. I'm a big fan of how Kray renders look and will support the next versions because I have faith in it.
Opening it to other software is a good move but this have to be prepared.
Kray needs to communicate more, interact better with the community that supports it (in terms of plans, infos) Jnom is right, and now more than before it's crucial that companies communicate more to grow or just survive.
More communication is more clients, more money to develop faster, better. I hope G is that ambitious...
I wish there was more tutos, LWCAD does it pretty well, videos to show new features and show how fast we can work with it.
Kray is a good renderer, a little more work on the communication side would have helped it shine.
Let's hope they Mindberries realises that one day like Newtek did after so many years.
But if you say it's better than Vray, maybe you haven't used VRay enough.
For Heavy scenes, Vray turns to be way faster, handles poly better.
Lights act more like real lights. Cameras have real parameters as well as the environment.
INstances are well handled, also for stuff like grass.
Renders are better handled, with Bucket rendering you calculate an image in few minutes.
AA is waaaaayy faster than Kray.
You find tons of ressources, tuts and the manual is really complete.
There a all the passes you need (+ working Alpha channel...)
Tons of shaders, real displacement, microdisplacement, and I could go again and again.
I can't see what you base your judgment on.
I'm not a VRay fan, I had so many projects that just couldn't be handled with LightWave + Kray.
These are the stuff I love, it's a real pleasure to work with this combo but Kray isn't mature yet. You CAN'T use it for serious productions. It's a sad truth. We need working Alpha, faster AA, faster shaders (specific for Kray), displacement, VPR and way more passes. I'm a big fan of how Kray renders look and will support the next versions because I have faith in it.
Opening it to other software is a good move but this have to be prepared.
Kray needs to communicate more, interact better with the community that supports it (in terms of plans, infos) Jnom is right, and now more than before it's crucial that companies communicate more to grow or just survive.
More communication is more clients, more money to develop faster, better. I hope G is that ambitious...
I wish there was more tutos, LWCAD does it pretty well, videos to show new features and show how fast we can work with it.
Kray is a good renderer, a little more work on the communication side would have helped it shine.
Let's hope they Mindberries realises that one day like Newtek did after so many years.
Re: kray 3.0 preview
quote khan973
the big big problem for kray is the lack of sharing between users.
This message does not want to be argumentative
but few material, few scene, few tutorial - we work with kray....it's give me the food for life...we don't play...we sell images.
2 or 3 pleople for all user aren't sufficient.
Kray is a very good sw but WE NEED MORE HELP.
if all grow the product grows
it's only my idea but for me this is the reality.
the big big problem for kray is the lack of sharing between users.
This message does not want to be argumentative
but few material, few scene, few tutorial - we work with kray....it's give me the food for life...we don't play...we sell images.
2 or 3 pleople for all user aren't sufficient.
Kray is a very good sw but WE NEED MORE HELP.
if all grow the product grows
it's only my idea but for me this is the reality.
Re: kray 3.0 preview
Its not really lack of sharing. Its lack of lw users in general. Turbulence4D is way behind the c4d version according to a lw/c4d user. There's just more c4d users out there so its a priority for the t4D developer.
I think its good move to try and capture sketchup users. The move by octane renderer is also a good one. Try to get as many people interested with octane to have as a native plugin renderer. Even poser and autocad is being developed with octane. I think modo renderer is used in solidworks. That's big income for lux. Time to get extra devs to port kray outside of lw while G can focus on the main renderer for lw.
I think its good move to try and capture sketchup users. The move by octane renderer is also a good one. Try to get as many people interested with octane to have as a native plugin renderer. Even poser and autocad is being developed with octane. I think modo renderer is used in solidworks. That's big income for lux. Time to get extra devs to port kray outside of lw while G can focus on the main renderer for lw.
Re: kray 3.0 preview
+1
We must also consider that there are SDK changes that occur too often for devs to keep up with LightWave and also SDK limitations that make development on C4D easier than LW. Remember Vue XStream, too many limitations on LW
I'm not sure it's only because of the user base.
However, I'm confident, LW3DGrou's p is doing great moves it needs more exposure though.
To me biggest problem is lack of tuts. Everything I learn about LW or Kray is on the forum.
Lack of materials too, almost no shaders.
Kurv studio is no more, but Rebelhill and some other folks are really good at explaining.
Lots of people seek for tutorials to learn. C4D got many people that way.
Evenb Renderman suffered from that for smaller companies, people thought they needed to code while it has changed. They put efforts in changing that perception.
We need Surface collections! Tutorials with stuff that look super good! Preset scenes
Everything that would make people want to get onboard, and things that would help us stay in the game and get better.
LOts of people don't know how to use VRay, they use presets. Most of them aren't good at shading, they use collections of shaders.
Still, we see lots of great or good renders, not hard to understand why. Those recipes are simple and still we don't have them.
LW has surfaces that are from the 90's and never evolved Kray doesn't have its own collection (great initiative on the forum though), no preset scenes.
My opinion is that a software, pugin can be as good as it can be, a bad marketing won't bring exposure. Blender made the right move a while ago, tuts, free projects and so on. I hope things will change, sometime I feel like it's tireing to swin alone against the flow.
I try not to be pessimistic, haven't met G but LW's team is awesome, they are great individual and faith in their passion. Still sometimes I have to be rational
We must also consider that there are SDK changes that occur too often for devs to keep up with LightWave and also SDK limitations that make development on C4D easier than LW. Remember Vue XStream, too many limitations on LW
I'm not sure it's only because of the user base.
However, I'm confident, LW3DGrou's p is doing great moves it needs more exposure though.
To me biggest problem is lack of tuts. Everything I learn about LW or Kray is on the forum.
Lack of materials too, almost no shaders.
Kurv studio is no more, but Rebelhill and some other folks are really good at explaining.
Lots of people seek for tutorials to learn. C4D got many people that way.
Evenb Renderman suffered from that for smaller companies, people thought they needed to code while it has changed. They put efforts in changing that perception.
We need Surface collections! Tutorials with stuff that look super good! Preset scenes
Everything that would make people want to get onboard, and things that would help us stay in the game and get better.
LOts of people don't know how to use VRay, they use presets. Most of them aren't good at shading, they use collections of shaders.
Still, we see lots of great or good renders, not hard to understand why. Those recipes are simple and still we don't have them.
LW has surfaces that are from the 90's and never evolved Kray doesn't have its own collection (great initiative on the forum though), no preset scenes.
My opinion is that a software, pugin can be as good as it can be, a bad marketing won't bring exposure. Blender made the right move a while ago, tuts, free projects and so on. I hope things will change, sometime I feel like it's tireing to swin alone against the flow.
I try not to be pessimistic, haven't met G but LW's team is awesome, they are great individual and faith in their passion. Still sometimes I have to be rational
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Keraressi Abdelkarim
- Posts: 719
- Joined: Sun Jan 24, 2010 4:44 pm
Re: kray 3.0 preview
For khan973 and other 
why i said kray better then vray cz vray its long time created beofore many years before kray . and kray give u the same result and in other scn much better and many of it fast then vray . so im talkin on Kray 3.0 ^^ yeah when it realised Vray die im sure about it.
but im very sorry about light ex.. u can use area light with kray u get the same effect as realsity not vray . i comprare realsitic vs kray . not kray vs vray . i know we need more .... nothing we need Kray 3.0 hihihihi .
and kray if u use kray u dont need tutorial cz its very easy if u know tricks u will find it like game boy (and i guess evrything on this forum there not secret) . but if u work with kray its pleasure and its work . not for fun . for fun when u did interior or exterior to try something dats for fun but when something have relation with job nothing fun . all seriously .
Lwcad ? why u need tutorial for lwcad . he is the base and fast to use no need tutorial . about it . if u understad the logic of lwcad u need just to see new features and dats it . no tutorial . mybe something new On Kray 3.0 who knows that need some basic tutorial to learn. but each one need to experiment alone with his program to get more skill . its my opinion thnx
why i said kray better then vray cz vray its long time created beofore many years before kray . and kray give u the same result and in other scn much better and many of it fast then vray . so im talkin on Kray 3.0
^^ yeah when it realised Vray die im sure about it.but im very sorry about light ex.. u can use area light with kray u get the same effect as realsity not vray
. i comprare realsitic vs kray . not kray vs vray . i know we need more .... nothing we need Kray 3.0 hihihihi . and kray if u use kray u dont need tutorial cz its very easy if u know tricks u will find it like game boy (and i guess evrything on this forum there not secret) . but if u work with kray its pleasure and its work
. not for fun . for fun when u did interior or exterior to try something dats for fun but when something have relation with job nothing fun . all seriously . Lwcad ? why u need tutorial for lwcad . he is the base and fast to use no need tutorial . about it . if u understad the logic of lwcad u need just to see new features and dats it . no tutorial . mybe something new On Kray 3.0 who knows that need some basic tutorial to learn. but each one need to experiment alone with his program to get more skill . its my opinion thnx
Re: kray 3.0 preview
i wonder..how could someone disagree on that?khan973 wrote:+1
We must also consider that there are SDK changes that occur too often for devs to keep up with LightWave and also SDK limitations that make development on C4D easier than LW. Remember Vue XStream, too many limitations on LW
I'm not sure it's only because of the user base.
However, I'm confident, LW3DGrou's p is doing great moves it needs more exposure though.
To me biggest problem is lack of tuts. Everything I learn about LW or Kray is on the forum.
Lack of materials too, almost no shaders.
Kurv studio is no more, but Rebelhill and some other folks are really good at explaining.
Lots of people seek for tutorials to learn. C4D got many people that way.
Evenb Renderman suffered from that for smaller companies, people thought they needed to code while it has changed. They put efforts in changing that perception.
We need Surface collections! Tutorials with stuff that look super good! Preset scenes
Everything that would make people want to get onboard, and things that would help us stay in the game and get better.
LOts of people don't know how to use VRay, they use presets. Most of them aren't good at shading, they use collections of shaders.
Still, we see lots of great or good renders, not hard to understand why. Those recipes are simple and still we don't have them.
LW has surfaces that are from the 90's and never evolved Kray doesn't have its own collection (great initiative on the forum though), no preset scenes.
My opinion is that a software, pugin can be as good as it can be, a bad marketing won't bring exposure. Blender made the right move a while ago, tuts, free projects and so on. I hope things will change, sometime I feel like it's tireing to swin alone against the flow.
I try not to be pessimistic, haven't met G but LW's team is awesome, they are great individual and faith in their passion. Still sometimes I have to be rational
Re: kray 3.0 preview
i want see future but now with 99€ to buy octane render - the plugin is newborn but can you think what's appened in future??
Re: kray 3.0 preview
Having different options to render in the same software is good.
Lightwave's native Raytracing render is awesome!
For GI I'd choose Kray. VRay must be the first to have gathered people and that can render for archviz, movies post production and so on.
I think it's because it renders fast of course but also because of passes.
When doing complexe things, having LW + dp filter is really powerful.
For now, since SDK has limitations I can see no external renderer being able to do that unless they implement the ability to manage passes with nodes to or can access the Pixel filters. I don't see that coming any time soon.
Kray has made a great decision putting its own pass management but its far too limited and there is far too few passes. It's too bad otherwise it would be kickass.
I know NO studio that renders straight without any passes for movie post production. Here we use Nuke so we need passes to make good 3D stuff. That's why Kray for us is just for fun or Archviz when projects are small and don't need animation.
I don't think a renderer is meant to be used only for fun or for hobbyists only so we must remain demanding with tools we want to use and they must be aware of what competitors offer and what the studios needs are.
Otherwise things will die like the forum is dying unfortunately...
Lightwave's native Raytracing render is awesome!
For GI I'd choose Kray. VRay must be the first to have gathered people and that can render for archviz, movies post production and so on.
I think it's because it renders fast of course but also because of passes.
When doing complexe things, having LW + dp filter is really powerful.
For now, since SDK has limitations I can see no external renderer being able to do that unless they implement the ability to manage passes with nodes to or can access the Pixel filters. I don't see that coming any time soon.
Kray has made a great decision putting its own pass management but its far too limited and there is far too few passes. It's too bad otherwise it would be kickass.
I know NO studio that renders straight without any passes for movie post production. Here we use Nuke so we need passes to make good 3D stuff. That's why Kray for us is just for fun or Archviz when projects are small and don't need animation.
I don't think a renderer is meant to be used only for fun or for hobbyists only so we must remain demanding with tools we want to use and they must be aware of what competitors offer and what the studios needs are.
Otherwise things will die like the forum is dying unfortunately...
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djwaterman
- Posts: 78
- Joined: Sun Apr 03, 2011 11:02 am
Re: kray 3.0 preview
Good to see some new discussion in the forum, and some new information about what's coming for Kray. We just need the occasional general announcements about the development to get us excited, when we hear nothing we stop coming by.
Re: kray 3.0 preview
Btw, any plan regarding on the price wise?
Would be more expensive? Planning to buy my own personal copy, not sure if I should buy a copy now or wait for KRay 3.0
Would be more expensive? Planning to buy my own personal copy, not sure if I should buy a copy now or wait for KRay 3.0
Re: kray 3.0 preview
Nothing has been decided just yet but I think the price should stay around the same point as it is now.jonathlee wrote:Btw, any plan regarding on the price wise?
Would be more expensive? Planning to buy my own personal copy, not sure if I should buy a copy now or wait for KRay 3.0
- Jure
Re: kray 3.0 preview
If i buy now, will I entitled for the v3.0 upgrade for free?