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Re: new exterior
Posted: Sun Aug 30, 2009 1:44 pm
by Janusz Biela
salvatore wrote:i already tested this technique for grass but my result was ugly.
Yes this is crap .... I thing one way is in Instance but.... we need special shader for this (something similar to FG for pixel , no FG per box) becouse grass is very comlex model so is long render (If we add shader FG with min/max 0/0 is still too slow, becouse still is too many polygons to calculate, QMC shader is fast but noise....)
Re: new exterior
Posted: Sun Aug 30, 2009 1:47 pm
by geo_n
Johny_quick wrote:salvatore wrote:i already tested this technique for grass but my result was ugly.
Yes this is crap .... I thing one way is in Instance but.... we need special shader for this (something similar to FG for pixel , no FG per box) becouse grass is very comlex model so is long render (If we add shader FG with min/max 0/0 is still too slow, becouse still is too many polygons to calculate, QMC shader is fast but noise....)
haha. i'm sure pavlov will be happy to hear its crap.
so how do we do animation in kray with good grass?
for me this is good. can be improved more in post process.
http://www.happy-digital.com/autograss/ ... movies.php
Re: new exterior
Posted: Sun Aug 30, 2009 3:51 pm
by jure
Acctualy I think Paolo's method works great. Fast and looks pretty good.
Re: new exterior
Posted: Mon Aug 31, 2009 7:30 am
by Janusz Biela
jure wrote:Acctualy I think Paolo's method works great. Fast and looks pretty good.
...I thing no
Re: new exterior
Posted: Mon Aug 31, 2009 4:06 pm
by jure
Johny_quick wrote:jure wrote:Acctualy I think Paolo's method works great. Fast and looks pretty good.
...I thing no
I think you don't know how to use it...
Re: new exterior
Posted: Wed Sep 02, 2009 8:10 pm
by larry_g1s
I think what Hieron was able to do with HDI, is one of the best grass animation examples I've scene in LW. And solid render times for the resolution.
http://www.newtek.com/forums/showthread.php?t=101604
Re: new exterior
Posted: Mon Sep 07, 2009 10:34 am
by done
Actually, the most important part of the HDI route is:
ps: The movie has DoF and slight MB done in post. More importantly it has "Neat Video"plugin applied to it, to do temporal blurring on the grass in the distance. Without that it is almost impossible to get rid of sampling issues when using a few pixels to visualize zillions of poly's.
I dont see using HD instance over native kray instances inside kray would have any benefits, and i think the basic logic is the same... the problematic part of animating it is the sampling, and Hieron also had to deal with it.
Re: new exterior
Posted: Tue Sep 08, 2009 1:05 pm
by geo_n
Its great. i disected it and it could work. There's just the problem with sampling small areas. Any renderer would flicker. I would probably not use instancing on the very far objects and just use a texture. Rendering is not bad at 12 min for qc6600.
Re: new exterior
Posted: Tue Sep 08, 2009 6:16 pm
by larry_g1s
geo_n wrote:
Its great. i disected it and it could work. There's just the problem with sampling small areas. Any renderer would flicker. I would probably not use instancing on the very far objects and just use a texture. Rendering is not bad at 12 min for qc6600.
He got 7+- minute renders for the animation (me too and I'm on Intel Quad Core...forget the number) and I don't remember any flickering in his animation.
Re: new exterior
Posted: Tue Sep 08, 2009 8:44 pm
by geo_n
Larry_g1s wrote:geo_n wrote:
Its great. i disected it and it could work. There's just the problem with sampling small areas. Any renderer would flicker. I would probably not use instancing on the very far objects and just use a texture. Rendering is not bad at 12 min for qc6600.
He got 7+- minute renders for the animation (me too and I'm on Intel Quad Core...forget the number) and I don't remember any flickering in his animation.
I rendered it and it does flicker and lots of noise. His render is very heavily post processed which is ok I do it all the time
. Trying to sample a small square with millions of grass pixels would cause flicker or noise regarless of renderer. One thing would be not to put instance at the back to lessen the chance of missing an instance's pixel. It looks smudged green anyway. Use a simpler texture, blur it and use a noise filter like neatplugin if it still has noise.
Re: new exterior
Posted: Tue Sep 15, 2009 5:49 pm
by larry_g1s
geo_n wrote:Its great. i disected it and it could work. There's just the problem with sampling small areas. Any renderer would flicker. I would probably not use instancing on the very far objects and just use a texture. Rendering is not bad at 12 min for qc6600. He got 7+- minute renders for the animation (me too and I'm on Intel Quad Core...forget the number) and I don't remember any flickering in his animation.
I rendered it and it does flicker and lots of noise. His render is very heavily post processed which is ok I do it all the time
. Trying to sample a small square with millions of grass pixels would cause flicker or noise regarless of renderer. One thing would be not to put instance at the back to lessen the chance of missing an instance's pixel. It looks smudged green anyway. Use a simpler texture, blur it and use a noise filter like neatplugin if it still has noise.
Quick update to the flickering issue. ADK on that thread came across a plug-in for (AE, Prem., Final Cut, and a host of others) that seemed to really help with the flicker in post. Check out the site:
http://www.neatvideo.com/
Re: new exterior
Posted: Wed Sep 16, 2009 5:19 am
by _mats_
That looks awesome, so HDI 2.07 works with Kray 100% then?
I have a license for 1.8 and would definitely upgrade in case this is so.
Re: new exterior
Posted: Wed Sep 16, 2009 8:36 am
by larry_g1s
_mats_ wrote:That looks awesome, so HDI 2.07 works with Kray 100% then?
I have a license for 1.8 and would definitely upgrade in case this is so.
I don't believe it works 100%. I don't think shadows show amongst other things.
Re: new exterior
Posted: Thu Sep 24, 2009 9:23 am
by adk
Larry_g1s wrote:geo_n wrote:Its great. i disected it and it could work. There's just the problem with sampling small areas. Any renderer would flicker. I would probably not use instancing on the very far objects and just use a texture. Rendering is not bad at 12 min for qc6600. He got 7+- minute renders for the animation (me too and I'm on Intel Quad Core...forget the number) and I don't remember any flickering in his animation.
I rendered it and it does flicker and lots of noise. His render is very heavily post processed which is ok I do it all the time
. Trying to sample a small square with millions of grass pixels would cause flicker or noise regarless of renderer. One thing would be not to put instance at the back to lessen the chance of missing an instance's pixel. It looks smudged green anyway. Use a simpler texture, blur it and use a noise filter like neatplugin if it still has noise.
Quick update to the flickering issue. ADK on that thread came across a plug-in for (AE, Prem., Final Cut, and a host of others) that seemed to really help with the flicker in post. Check out the site:
http://www.neatvideo.com/
Correction there Larry ... Hieron mentioned the NeatVideo plugin & I simply did some testing with it in Fusion and AE together with RSMB. It works so well that I don't think I'd render any such scene without it to be honest. You could easily double /quadruple your render time trying to get rid of pixels fizzing with AA / AS / OS /downsizing renders combinations, not to mention the time spent finding an economical setting. It's the most distracting thing in my view as the further away from the camera it is the more it fizzes & the first thing your eyes lock onto and scream "that's not right".
Would love to hear others views on how they deal with this issue in animations with heavy foliage / texture shimmering / fizzing.